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vi...@google.com
Thank you for reporting this issue.
We cannot check this issue in pixel devices as they doesn't support external sdcard.
For us to further investigate this issue, please provide the following additional information:
* APK/App Name that you're developing and affected by this issue (*Required)
* Device Make and Model (*Required)
* Android OS version (*Required)
* Related API or developer doc (*Required)
Please provide executable sample project or apk to reproduce the issue. Also mention the steps to be followed for reproducing the issue with the given sample project or apk.
How frequently does this issue occur? (e.g 100% of the time, 10% of the time)
What is the expected output?
What is the current output?
Android bug report (to be captured after reproducing the issue)
For steps to capture a bug report, please refer:https://developer.android.com/studio/debug/bug-report#bugreportdevice
Alternate method
Navigate to “Developer options”, ensure “USB debugging” is enabled, then enable “Bug report shortcut”. Capture bug report by holding the power button and selecting the “Take bug report” option.
Screen Record of the Issue
Please capture screen record or video of the issue using following steps:
adb shell screenrecord /sdcard/video.mp4
Subsequently use following command to pull the recorded file:
adb pull /sdcard/video.mp4
Attach the file to this issue.
Note: Please upload the bug report and screenshot to google drive and share the folder to android-bugreport@google.com, then share the link here.
We cannot check this issue in pixel devices as they doesn't support external sdcard.
For us to further investigate this issue, please provide the following additional information:
* APK/App Name that you're developing and affected by this issue (*Required)
* Device Make and Model (*Required)
* Android OS version (*Required)
* Related API or developer doc (*Required)
Please provide executable sample project or apk to reproduce the issue. Also mention the steps to be followed for reproducing the issue with the given sample project or apk.
How frequently does this issue occur? (e.g 100% of the time, 10% of the time)
What is the expected output?
What is the current output?
Android bug report (to be captured after reproducing the issue)
For steps to capture a bug report, please refer:
Alternate method
Navigate to “Developer options”, ensure “USB debugging” is enabled, then enable “Bug report shortcut”. Capture bug report by holding the power button and selecting the “Take bug report” option.
Screen Record of the Issue
Please capture screen record or video of the issue using following steps:
adb shell screenrecord /sdcard/video.mp4
Subsequently use following command to pull the recorded file:
adb pull /sdcard/video.mp4
Attach the file to this issue.
Note: Please upload the bug report and screenshot to google drive and share the folder to android-bugreport@google.com, then share the link here.
pa...@gmail.com
So far there are not that many devices both with external SD card support and Android 11. We received complains from owners of Samsung s10 and s20 devices after OS update.
If you have no means of reproduction I will raise issue with Samsung support then, but meanwhile I would ask to forward question to some experts that wrote
vi...@google.com
Please share the bugreport and screenrecord of the issue for us to check the performance loss issue.
Along with expected and current output.
Along with expected and current output.
mi...@gmail.com
I will be happy if you fix my phone Thanks
vi...@google.com
Please provide the information as requested in
vi...@google.com
We’ll be closing this issue due to not having enough actionable information. If you continue to have this issue, please open a new issue and add the relevant information along with a reference link to the earlier issue.
pa...@gmail.com
So according to Samsung support FUSE cannot be bypassed on SD card even for application'a private storage:
FUSE performance loss cannot be mitigated for external private directories on SD card (External Removable) according to the current Android 11 policy. This is not the Samsung change but common in all the AOSP devices. Because everything under the SD card (External Removable) works on FUSE.
It is possible to mitigate the performance loss on emulated private directories on the internal storage only.
· Emulated private directories: /storage/emulated/0/Android/Data -> (bypass FUSE)
· External private directories on SD card (External Removable): /storage/XXXX-XXXX/Android/Data -> (FUSE)
pa...@gmail.com
Comment has been deleted.
pa...@gmail.com
Also we did some tests on Motorola moto g PRO
Android 10 benchmark: 49 577 ns 17 allocs ReadFromFileBenchmark.runOnInternal benchmark: 61 674 ns 17 allocs ReadFromFileBenchmark.runOnExternalRemovable
Android 11 benchmark: 49 039 ns 17 allocs ReadFromFileBenchmark.runOnInternal benchmark: 6 861 407 ns 17 allocs ReadFromFileBenchmark.runOnExternalRemovable
Looks like like Android SD card support we can now add to
jo...@gmail.com
Why is security more important than usability? Especially when usability is near impossible. Imagine purchasing a high performance vehicle but the manufacturer governed the speed to 10 mph. Sorry we don't want you to get into any accidents therefore we cannot allow you to drive any faster. It's for your own good.
mi...@protonmail.ch
Devices up to kernel 5.4 should use SDCardFS and/or adoption to mitigate the fuse penalty
https://source.android.com/devices/storage/sdcardfs-deprecate
After that you have passthrough
https://source.android.com/devices/storage/fuse-passthrough
Then, even if the docs claim portable storage is always going to have to pass through SAF.. did you try the file api with MANAGE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE?
https://source.android.com/devices/storage/traditional
https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/149420530#comment10
After that you have passthrough
Then, even if the docs claim portable storage is always going to have to pass through SAF.. did you try the file api with MANAGE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE?
vi...@google.com
For us to further investigate this issue, please provide the following additional information:
* APK/App Name that you're developing and affected by this issue (*Required)
* Device Make and Model (*Required)
* Android OS version (*Required)
* Related API or developer doc (*Required)
Please provide sample project or apk to reproduce the issue. Also mention the steps to be followed for reproducing the issue with the given sample project or apk.
How frequently does this issue occur? (e.g 100% of the time, 10% of the time)
What is the expected output?
What is the current output?
Android bug report (to be captured after reproducing the issue)
For steps to capture a bug report, please refer:https://developer.android.com/studio/debug/bug-report#bugreportdevice
Alternate method
Navigate to “Developer options”, ensure “USB debugging” is enabled, then enable “Bug report shortcut”. Capture bug report by holding the power button and selecting the “Take bug report” option.
Screen Record of the Issue
Please capture screen record or video of the issue using following steps:
adb shell screenrecord /sdcard/video.mp4
Subsequently use following command to pull the recorded file:
adb pull /sdcard/video.mp4
Attach the file to this issue.
* APK/App Name that you're developing and affected by this issue (*Required)
* Device Make and Model (*Required)
* Android OS version (*Required)
* Related API or developer doc (*Required)
Please provide sample project or apk to reproduce the issue. Also mention the steps to be followed for reproducing the issue with the given sample project or apk.
How frequently does this issue occur? (e.g 100% of the time, 10% of the time)
What is the expected output?
What is the current output?
Android bug report (to be captured after reproducing the issue)
For steps to capture a bug report, please refer:
Alternate method
Navigate to “Developer options”, ensure “USB debugging” is enabled, then enable “Bug report shortcut”. Capture bug report by holding the power button and selecting the “Take bug report” option.
Screen Record of the Issue
Please capture screen record or video of the issue using following steps:
adb shell screenrecord /sdcard/video.mp4
Subsequently use following command to pull the recorded file:
adb pull /sdcard/video.mp4
Attach the file to this issue.
sa...@google.com
Please provide the requested information to proceed further.
ke...@gmail.com
Sony Xperia 1 III is nearly useless with SAF. An excellent test case is OsmAnd+
The previously recommended method to make OsmAnd+ work is to select a non-scoped directory on a microSd card, like /storage/XXXX-XXXX/OsmAnd. I can literally download of all of Earth (detailed map, contour lines, hillshade) using this technique and it's real-time responsive. If maps are placed inside the app's scoped storage, the app becomes completely unusable. How slow? Operations slow enough to time without SAF take too long to complete with SAF. I'd say the ballpark number is about 10000 slower. Even a map of the US west coast is completely unusable through SAF - all apps using the microSd card lock up for 30+ minutes at a time.
As of November, new releases of multiple data-intensive apps have stopped working because of SAF.
Only known workaround: Ask app developers to move out of Play Store before their next release
Sony XQ-BC62 with firmware 61.0.A.15.35
OsmAnd+ 4.0.8
SanDisk Extreme PRO microSDXC (100 to 170 MB/sec reads)
https://github.com/osmandapp/OsmAnd/issues/13254
https://github.com/osmandapp/OsmAnd/issues/12046
https://github.com/osmandapp/OsmAnd/issues/10453
https://github.com/osmandapp/OsmAnd/issues/13219
The previously recommended method to make OsmAnd+ work is to select a non-scoped directory on a microSd card, like /storage/XXXX-XXXX/OsmAnd. I can literally download of all of Earth (detailed map, contour lines, hillshade) using this technique and it's real-time responsive. If maps are placed inside the app's scoped storage, the app becomes completely unusable. How slow? Operations slow enough to time without SAF take too long to complete with SAF. I'd say the ballpark number is about 10000 slower. Even a map of the US west coast is completely unusable through SAF - all apps using the microSd card lock up for 30+ minutes at a time.
As of November, new releases of multiple data-intensive apps have stopped working because of SAF.
Only known workaround: Ask app developers to move out of Play Store before their next release
Sony XQ-BC62 with firmware 61.0.A.15.35
OsmAnd+ 4.0.8
SanDisk Extreme PRO microSDXC (100 to 170 MB/sec reads)
am...@google.com
Can you please provide the video depicting the issue and Bugreport too?
Also, any related developer doc having the expected behavior would be helpful.
Thank you.
Also, any related developer doc having the expected behavior would be helpful.
Thank you.
am...@google.com
Please provide all the input requested in
ex...@gmail.com
I'd like to add to this and confirm that file access using SAF has become 15 times slower when using SAF on a Pixel 3 compared to standard File access. Our media player app needs to scan one or more user-selectable directories for audio files. Some audio formats are unknown to the Media Store and the we need to parse each file for meta data because the Android media database does not provide enough information. The performance hit is primarily in getContentResolver().openFileDescriptor() and reading data in native code using this fd.
I sincerely doubt that Google will allow a media player to request the 'all access' permission so we are basically stuck here.
I sincerely doubt that Google will allow a media player to request the 'all access' permission so we are basically stuck here.
ex...@gmail.com
We have a video showing the performance comparison between 'all files permission' + File API and the SAF API scanning the same files for meta data. If you want to see it, please contact me privately. Using SAF is 10 times slower on the Pixel 3 internal storage. Furthermore, when filling in the 'Sensitive permissions' information in the developer console, it states that "Improving the performance of your app is not an acceptable reason" (to request all access permission).
vi...@google.com
Kindly attach the video as requested in the above comments.
ke...@gmail.com
Dear self-absorbed Googlers,
I noticed a disturbing, even abusive, pattern by Googlers in IssueTracker. Stop rejecting tickets because they can't be reproduced on a crude Pixel phone. Pixel phones are such an insignificant percentage of the global market share that I can't even find a chart where they're not in the "others" category. XDA shows many people have a sudden interest in putting 3rd party ROMs on new phones because Android 11 and 12 are awful. Do the proper work to investigate tickets or Google won't be in the Android business much longer.
Hell, you can even do a Google search for "Android SAF slow".
I'm here because you're breaking very expensive hardware that I purchased. You're breaking apps that I paid for. You're killing the software developers that I buy software from. And for all of that, you look for the tiniest excuse to reject issues for very well known problems.
br...@gmail.com
ex...@gmail.com : They need the video
br...@gmail.com
What is in ticket 212232967?
vi...@google.com
Thank you for reporting this issue. We have shared this with our product and engineering team and will update this issue with more information as it becomes available.
pf...@mtu.edu
I'm not especially adding much to the conversation, but I'm currently running Lineage OS on a Moto G7+ (Lineage Lake) and have run into this being an issue with OSMAND+.
It took over 2.5 hours to transfer 13gigs of maps from internal storage to the SD card, and after doing so, maps now take significantly longer to load. I have a brand new SanDisk Extreme Pro U3 V30 card. The read speed on the card is excellent and it appears that this storage framework is to blame entirely.
A big reason I will not buy a modern phone is the lack of SD card/ External storage support. This feels like an attack on users like me that need an external storage card.
I'm sorry that my comment isn't much more than a "Bump" to your thread, but it is a significant impact.
It took over 2.5 hours to transfer 13gigs of maps from internal storage to the SD card, and after doing so, maps now take significantly longer to load. I have a brand new SanDisk Extreme Pro U3 V30 card. The read speed on the card is excellent and it appears that this storage framework is to blame entirely.
A big reason I will not buy a modern phone is the lack of SD card/ External storage support. This feels like an attack on users like me that need an external storage card.
I'm sorry that my comment isn't much more than a "Bump" to your thread, but it is a significant impact.
pa...@gmail.com
Hey friends,
I saw there was desire for video. While trying to compare between app launch and map load times on internal storage versus SD card storage I screen recorded this.
The comparison is unavailable because the maps load faster than the start time of the screen recorder when on internal storage.
Keep in mind that this is actually only half loaded and the conture lines didn't load, this is also a zoomed out view.
This is such a huge detriment to my workflow.
I'm the same user as the one above just on a different account.
I saw there was desire for video. While trying to compare between app launch and map load times on internal storage versus SD card storage I screen recorded this.
The comparison is unavailable because the maps load faster than the start time of the screen recorder when on internal storage.
Keep in mind that this is actually only half loaded and the conture lines didn't load, this is also a zoomed out view.
This is such a huge detriment to my workflow.
I'm the same user as the one above just on a different account.
br...@gmail.com
pa...@gmail.com:
Please just start the screen recording and let it start before you attempt. Can you do that?
Please just start the screen recording and let it start before you attempt. Can you do that?
pa...@gmail.com
Attached.
I even trimmed the three seconds at the start of my home screen.
I even trimmed the three seconds at the start of my home screen.
ke...@gmail.com
Any progress? Does Android maintenance need to be taken away from Google just to make a working phone?
pa...@gmail.com
My video attachment comment didn't do it justice to how bad the performance is. It must have been an outlier on the fast side for loading.
Performance for SD cards is abysmal.
Performance for SD cards is abysmal.
so...@gmail.com
Just run "time find ." in a directory containing 10k files. You will see that Android 9 fx. is much faster than android 11. Also you will notice that consecutive run does not get faster - so no caching of file metadata is en effect.
pa...@gmail.com
The above comment nails it. Performance is abysmal and I've resorted to using two phones just so I can keep OSMAND on internal memory on the second phone.
My video doesn't show trying to navigate somewhere and getting bad delays either. Please consider making it more severe, it really breaks the app. I've entirely stopped using OSM on my primary phone because of this bug.
My video doesn't show trying to navigate somewhere and getting bad delays either. Please consider making it more severe, it really breaks the app. I've entirely stopped using OSM on my primary phone because of this bug.
cr...@gmail.com
As expected, this not only affects app-specific directories, but also the shared storage on the removable SD card, heavily affecting file synchronization and file management apps. It takes upwards of 30 minutes to traverse a folder (not even opening the files, just the file attributes) with 20k files in a file synchronization app, Syncthing. Seriously, in the age of ultra-fast SSD drives, how is this acceptable? You take one of the most fundamental aspects of a computing device – data storage and retrieval – and turn it into something that's so incredibly slow that it takes literal orders of magnitude longer than before FUSE on Android 11.
Remember, this operating system is running on a device that cost me $1400. I can get a computer that can perform the same function, with more storage, orders of literal magnitude faster for half the price of the Android device. And it looks like nobody at Google (a multibillion-dollar company) is able to take the time out of their day to give a reply other than a standard boilerplate one that completely disregards how badly they messed up the most basic fundamental of a computing device.
Keep in mind that people use their thousand-dollar computing devices to do more than:
a) stream movies through YouTube Music
b) use anything other than Google Photos and Google Drive to offload files - yes, SD cards are a thing
c) use Google One to backup their devices - yes, file synchronization apps exist and are a thing
d) store large media files somewhere else than Google Play Music and Google Drive
e) store less than 1000 files in a directory
---
If somehow, the ~32 comments that are above this is not enough to convince anybody at Google that this is a legitimate problem that is severely affecting real, paying customers, here's a few links:
https://forum.syncthing.net/t/how-to-deal-with-abysmal-i-o-performance-on-android-10/
https://www.reddit.com/r/LineageOS/comments/p7inuy/awful_storage_performance_on_181/
https://www.reddit.com/r/androidroot/comments/njarf8/theres_any_way_to_disable_scoped_storage_in/
https://www.reddit.com/r/androiddev/comments/kpn68k/android_11_very_slow_file_access_performance/
https://github.com/syncthing/syncthing-android/issues/1570
https://github.com/syncthing/syncthing-android/issues/1630
https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/android-11-file-system-is-way-slower.4254079/ (apparently not for SD cards)
Congratulations to Google for killing SD card storage, probably unintentionally over their Scoped Storage stuff. After all, there must be no need to support performant SD card usage if Pixels - which have less than 3% market share in the US - don't have microSD slots! Looking forward to paying hundreds of dollars annually for YouTube Music for offline music storage, Google Drive for my storage expansion needs, and Google Play Movies (if that's even a thing anymore).
On a sidenote, my directory containing 100k files has still not completed scanning after the 1.5 hours I've spent researching this issue and writing this comment. Congratulations. The same operation took less than 8 minutes on a spinning hard drive mounted to a Mac.
Remember, this operating system is running on a device that cost me $1400. I can get a computer that can perform the same function, with more storage, orders of literal magnitude faster for half the price of the Android device. And it looks like nobody at Google (a multibillion-dollar company) is able to take the time out of their day to give a reply other than a standard boilerplate one that completely disregards how badly they messed up the most basic fundamental of a computing device.
Keep in mind that people use their thousand-dollar computing devices to do more than:
a) stream movies through YouTube Music
b) use anything other than Google Photos and Google Drive to offload files - yes, SD cards are a thing
c) use Google One to backup their devices - yes, file synchronization apps exist and are a thing
d) store large media files somewhere else than Google Play Music and Google Drive
e) store less than 1000 files in a directory
---
If somehow, the ~32 comments that are above this is not enough to convince anybody at Google that this is a legitimate problem that is severely affecting real, paying customers, here's a few links:
Congratulations to Google for killing SD card storage, probably unintentionally over their Scoped Storage stuff. After all, there must be no need to support performant SD card usage if Pixels - which have less than 3% market share in the US - don't have microSD slots! Looking forward to paying hundreds of dollars annually for YouTube Music for offline music storage, Google Drive for my storage expansion needs, and Google Play Movies (if that's even a thing anymore).
On a sidenote, my directory containing 100k files has still not completed scanning after the 1.5 hours I've spent researching this issue and writing this comment. Congratulations. The same operation took less than 8 minutes on a spinning hard drive mounted to a Mac.
ke...@gmail.com
Apps are being distributed outside of Google Play Store as a workaround. This allows them to be manually granted the permission "Allow management of all files". Once that's done, the app's files can be moved out of the slow SAF directory.
This works for Termux, OsmAnd~, Kiwix, LibreTorrent, and others.
This works for Termux, OsmAnd~, Kiwix, LibreTorrent, and others.
so...@gmail.com
Happy New Year..
Google - what is the status ???
Google - what is the status ???
pa...@gmail.com
Happy New Year!
I also would appreciate an update, this still sucks.
I recently got NextCloud backups running and I believe they are also hindered by this.
I also would appreciate an update, this still sucks.
I recently got NextCloud backups running and I believe they are also hindered by this.
ai...@gmail.com
Happy New Year!
Although absolutely not expecting any updates, I'm curious what does #9 look like before it got deleted, did the origin author delete it?
Although absolutely not expecting any updates, I'm curious what does #9 look like before it got deleted, did the origin author delete it?
st...@gmail.com
Same issue on Lenovo tb-8506X, with TB-8506X_S000037_221027_ROW
but not on Motorola One Action (moa), Well on the moa the sd-card seems to Work fine.
but not on Motorola One Action (moa), Well on the moa the sd-card seems to Work fine.
st...@gmail.com
PS:
Motorola One Action Build-NR
RSBS31.Q1-48-36-23-2
Motorola One Action Build-NR
RSBS31.Q1-48-36-23-2
so...@gmail.com
#39 - you are misunderstanding the problem. It has nothing to do with the performance of already opened files. It relates to the security audits done during fetching of directory listings and file metadata using "stat".
so...@gmail.com
Comment has been deleted.
vi...@google.com
Thank you for your feedback. We are closing the issue as won't fix obsolete. If this issue still exists in a current Android build, we request that you log a new issue along with the bug report here
ke...@gmail.com
Comment has been deleted.
ko...@gmail.com
In my case, as the number of files in a folder increases; it becomes slower to create the next file. On my Samsung SM-225, I'm trying to bulk download images in the App-specific directory using Java File API; it gets progressively slower as more images are downloaded. FileOutputStream.<init> call takes nearly 500ms (when 10000 files are present) up from 6-7ms (when the folder is empty). This kind of performance is unacceptable to the user from a modern device.
pa...@gmail.com
Hey I saw this ticket got marked "Won't fix obsolete" but it isn't obsolete and that's a poor response. Devices still ship with removable storage. I won't buy a new phone without it.
po...@gmail.com
This issue should definitely be addressed.
br...@gmail.com
Why is this obsoleted? What happened? The issue continues.
ps...@gmail.com
Comment has been deleted.
Description
Since S20 got Android 11 update, our users experience slow app loading when app's files are stored on SD card.
Looks like File API performance on removable storage is now 50-100x slower than when reading from internal disk. I wrote simple benchmark comparing file manipulation under paths returned by
Context.getFilesDir()orContext.getExternalFilesDir(null)Steps to reproduce: